With the aim of re-engaging on Flickr (I’ve maintained a Pro account for several years, but have rarely logged in the past few), I recently joined the group Street & Repeat 108, a street photography “boot camp.” The curriculum includes bi-monthly instructions from selected photographers who essentially give an assignment to the group’s members, who, in response, must shoot new work to contribute to the photo pool as their homework.
Administrators, moderators and members alike are encouraged to chime in with commentary on each other’s entries as they are posted — as the group’s official description states, the objective of this boot camp is its members improvement, in large part from “giving and receiving frank and honest feedback.”
And that’s exactly what I’ve experienced so far for the past two instructions in which I’ve participated. Plenty of photos contributed (41 for March’s first instruction) and plenty of comments made on those photos (6 on my own contribution to that instruction). It seems, refreshingly, this truly is an online group cultivating a community built on a very active, ongoing conversation between street photography enthusiasts.
Along with dispensing the prompt, each instructor is also interviewed during his or her instruction period. Because we both live and shoot in the same city, Chicago, one of the group’s administrators, John Paddler, requested I step in as guest interviewer of the latest boot camp “counselor,” Mike McCawley. Of course I jumped at the opportunity — I’ve been following Mike on Instagram for a year or so and am definitely a fan of his work.
Q & A with Mike McCawley
C.P. Plunkett: From your Full Frontal Flash interview, I read that you’ve been interested in candid photography since you were a kid. However, it wasn’t until after you moved to Evanston / Chicago that you dove into it yourself. Was there anything about the city that sparked or called you to finally start shooting?
“I moved to Chicago and fell in love with the city immediately.”
Mike McCawley: Good question … I think it was a few things. One, there are just lots of interesting people and cool things happening all the time around the city. I moved to Chicago from Washington State almost 15 years ago now and fell in love with the city immediately. So I always wanted to document what I was seeing. Also, though, Chicago has a very strong and active photography community. When I got started with taking pictures generally, I ended up getting out on a lot of photo walks where I’d see some local street shooters work, and I think that helped nudge me in this direction. Definitely helped having that support system around.
CP: Given that Chicago has four distinct seasons (and particularly “harsh” winters, depending on your perspective), do you shoot year round? A favorite time of year or conditions to shoot in?
MM: I definitely shoot more when it’s nicer out, but that’s both because of the cold keeping me inside and also just a lot less happening during that time. The Chicago winters suck and seem never ending — but almost nothing beats Spring/Summer/Fall here. As soon as it gets nice, there’s an explosion of events and cool stuff going on, so it can actually be hard to make time for it all. I did go out and shoot in a late season blizzard a couple weeks ago, but only lasted about 10 minutes and got nothing, haha.
CP: How frequently do you shoot? Are you someone who has a non-smartphone camera with you a lot, even when you’re not out purposefully to shoot street?
MM: I don’t shoot very often. I’m not someone like Aaron Berger who is out shooting all, day every day bringing home piles of gold. But I do almost always carry my camera with me in my bag in case I see a reason to use it.
CP: If you’re out shooting, what is a typical frequency for how often you hit the shutter: every minute? Every ten? Obviously, there’s a lot of variance, but I think some people definitely shoot at a higher or lower volume.
MM: Again, depends on the situation. I’m pretty picky when I’m out and about with what I click the shutter for anymore. But a scene that’s hitting my interest buttons, I might take a hundred shots in just a short time.
CP: What do you think your ratio is of hitting the shutter vs. getting something that works or is “shareable’?
“I’m much more creative and able to ‘see’ things when I’m shooting some some kind of location or event that grabs my interest.”
— Mike McCawley
MM: I honestly don’t find a lot of excitement out on the street on a day to day basis around here. So if I do go out to shoot, it doesn’t usually turn into very many good shots for me. I’m much more creative and able to “see” things when I’m shooting some some kind of location or event that grabs my interest. If I’m on the street, I might get 1 decent keeper out of 50-75 clicks. If I’m at a county fair pie eating contest, I might walk away with five or more shots I’m really happy with in a 10-minute span.
CP: Have you ever shot with another photographer out on the street? If so, how do you like it vs. being by yourself?
MM: I love shooting with others. Mostly because I just like to shoot the shit with a fellow photographer while we do it. It can be fun to see what others see that you may have missed, or to see photos of same scene taken with different eyes. It’s actually a great learning experience and I encourage people to do it.
CP: What was the curve like for you in regard to first taking people’s photos in public, and perhaps more so, getting closer as you did so? Given your experience and how you obviously get close to subjects in your photos now, is there still any hesitancy that you experience?
MM: I think my curve followed most people’s. I started out far away, zooming in a bit with my kit lens. I’m not sure when I started really getting closer, but one thing that pushed me in that direction was when I started shooting with a fixed lens on my X100T. Also, I really like images where you can see a lot of small detail and the only way to get that is to get close. At some point I realized that most people just don’t notice or don’t care. I do experience hesitancy, but I like to think I’m a pretty good judge of a situation and I’ll adjust my shooting style to the setting. If I feel the need to be real sneaky, I’ll fumble with my camera Winogrand-style while shooting, or I’ll do the move of looking through the viewfinder at something high, and then bringing the camera down low while acting like I’m reviewing a photo while I actually snap the shutter. Or if I’m feeling comfortable in a situation where taking photos isn’t odd-seeming, I won’t hide a thing and will get right up into faces with my off-camera flash acting like some kind of news photographer.
CP: Is there any obligation for a street photographer toward the photo being representational to what happened beyond that slice of a second? Photos are obviously capable of essentially lying; do we as street photographers have the license to lean into that?
MM: My number one goal is to make an interesting photo, regardless if it reflects reality or not (that boy wasn’t really being eaten by a boa, for instance).
CP: Have you ever taken a street photography workshop? If so, how was your experience? Worth it?
MM: Not a workshop, per se, but I’ve found that spending time around other photographers always makes me better — whether at a festival like Miami (Editor’s note: Mike was a 2017 MSPF Finalist) or just hanging out with a group of people that are passionate about the genre. In Miami, I got to listen to people like Larry Fink and Richard Sandler and Constantine Manos discuss their work. I just attended an Alec Soth talk in Milwaukee. Those experiences have been so invaluable to me as I try to figure all of this out.
“I’ve found that spending time around other photographers always makes me better.”
A tangent, but speaking of Alec Soth: one thing I took away from his lecture was the idea of a “steering wheel list.” Soth had a list he’d written down with ideas/things that he wanted to think about and keep an eye out for. Some fairly broad like “swimming pools” and others very specific like “Red headed woman in sunflowers” (those may not be exactly what he had on his list, but that’s the gist.) So right now I’m getting ready for a road trip with my family down to New Orleans and one thing I’m working on is my own steering wheel list. A random sampling from it at the moment: covered things, taxidermy, jigsaw puzzles, mid-century modern, dinosaurs. Basically, things that grab my interest that may or may not grab somebody else’s — but I think that putting them in writing will get me to see better as I go. That’s the hope anyway.
CP: Have you ever put together a series or magazine or book of your photos? If so, how was that experience different for you beyond simply going out and shooting whatever catches your eye? It seems like doing so is a step forward as photographers mature and grow.
MM: Putting a series together is something new I’m working on. I don’t have enough experience so far to really speak on it except to say that it’s a lot harder and takes a lot more careful thought than I realized.
CP: Is this photo beautiful? I guess, in a way, I’m asking what is “photographic” and does the genre of street photography deal with making something “beautiful.” Is a better word interesting? Compelling? Moving? Some other word?
“What I’m after more than anything is making an interesting photo, regardless of its beauty.”
MM: Oh boy, you would pick that one, haha. First of all, I don’t believe our work should be “beautiful.” It can be and often is, but what I’m after more than anything is making an interesting photo, regardless of its beauty. Now, it should still be taken well from a technical standpoint; but, above all else, I want my work to be interesting. Any other emotions that are elicited will flow from there.
That said … I have a complicated relationship with that photo. It’s a person down on their luck, which I 99% of the time shy away from for obvious reasons that don’t need hashed out here. But also, I had just gotten into San Francisco to spend time there for the first time really, and I walked out of my hotel to do some street shooting. Within 3 minutes, I saw this lady cleaning her rear end with newspapers in front of some high-end stores. I thought to myself, “Well, this is San Francisco”. It’s not a photo that I’m super proud of, but I do think it has some value as an interesting frame. I dunno, it might end up deleted before this gets posted, haha.
CP: Are you yourself the first and foremost audience of your work? Is there any merit in perhaps sharing something that you might think objectively works for your audience, but doesn’t particularly excite you?
MM: I don’t know if there is merit, but certainly there are some shots I’ll take and share because I know it will strike the right chord with a lot of people and, like I said, I do enjoy that dopamine burst of attention a pile of faves and whatnot gives you. I know it’s not the “cool artist” thing to say, but who doesn’t love a bit of positive attention? That said, those shots never stick around very long in my “catalog” of keepers. I edit the old work on my Flickr from time to time, deleting the stuff that doesn’t work for me now like it did when I took it.
I won’t purposefully share a “bad” shot, but if it ticks the right boxes and works for what it is, I will share it even if it’s not exactly my cup of tea.
CP: Given social media is now the predominant way to share photos and its UX is arranged as a chronological (more or less) feed, do you think there is an underlying expectation or pressure that photos shared should be recent?
MM: Maybe, but I think it’s more a matter of people not wanting to see the same shots over and over. If they’re following you, it’s (hopefully) because they like your work and want to see more of it. I’m always excited when favorite photographers of mine post great new stuff. But at the same time, if I’m in a lull of shooting, I’ll still throw old shots up on Instagram to satisfy that dopamine craving that a few Faves might give me. Since I don’t have a website, Flickr is where I keep things more tightly edited and I almost only post new work.
CP: If you’ve looked at a bunch of street photography, there might develop a “seen that before” perspective when viewing new work. How often are you “wowed” by photos when viewing work nowadays? Are you still finding new photographers and new street photography that grabs you?
“I find myself a lot harder to please when looking at most work, but I think that’s the goal.”
MM: I was just at a big photography exhibit in Milwaukee called “The Open Road” which had amazing prints from pretty much all of the greats: Frank, Winogrand, Meyerowitz, Eggleston, Soth, and so many more. I was wow’d through the entire thing, even by work I’d seen before on a computer screen or in a book. I find myself a lot harder to please when looking at most work, but I think that’s the goal: to continually refine your tastes so that you’re never satisfied and always chasing something better (like the famous Ira Glass quote about “the gap”).
CP: What obligation, if any, do you think you have to being an audience / active follower to other street photographers? If you’re expecting people to be an audience for you — to like, save, comment, share your photos — should you be doing that on behalf of others?
MM: I don’t think it’s an obligation. I look at work I like from photographers I like and don’t really get into that “you scratch my back, I’ll scratch yours” mentality.
CP: In your time since beginning to shoot street photography, have you ever quit or taken an extended period of time away?
“Time away from my camera might have been the best thing that ever happened to me.”
MM: Not on purpose. Although, I certainly have had lulls and dry spells where I just didn’t feel much like picking the camera up. I did have a good six months off a couple of years ago when I broke my camera and couldn’t afford to get it fixed right away. I shot with my backups, but don’t love them, so I didn’t get out much. Still, though, in that time I came away with at least two or three shots with my backup cameras that I still quite like. But mostly I spent my broken-camera time studying work. Looking at photo books. Thinking about what I wanted to shoot. Getting a lot more philosophical about what I was doing. That sort of thing. Honestly, that time away from my camera might have been the best thing that ever happened to me. because it did get me thinking about photography more than actually doing it, which is a good exercise. I think because of that, when I did get my camera back, I had a bit of an explosion of work I was really excited about making.
CP: Also, I see that you’ve traveled (e.g., San Francisco) to shoot in other cities. How does home compare or stack up to them?
MM: I wish I could travel more! Because I do love how fresh terrain helps me to see better. I’m actually writing this from New Orleans at the moment. My wife and I were married here and we visit pretty regularly, but I haven’t been able to make too many good pictures here yet for some reason. I think I get too focused on the craziness and forget how to shoot around the edges for the real interesting stuff.
Every city had its own vibe I guess. Miami is loud and colorful and there’s a lot of skin. Chicago quite the opposite. New Orleans you almost have people with too much visual flair, it gets cliché quickly.
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